02/06/2003 01:34 PM House TRA
| Audio | Topic |
|---|
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE TRANSPORTATION STANDING COMMITTEE
February 6, 2003
1:34 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Jim Holm, Co-Chair
Representative Beverly Masek, Co-Chair
Representative Hugh Fate
Representative Cheryll Heinze
Representative Vic Kohring
Representative Mary Kapsner
Representative Albert Kookesh
MEMBERS ABSENT
All members present
OTHER LEGISLATORS PRESENT
Representative David Guttenberg
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
HOUSE CONCURRENT RESOLUTION NO. 3
Relating to economic development generated by new road
construction and to the design and construction of the Hot
Springs Loop Road to connect Chena Hot Springs and Circle Hot
Springs.
- HEARD AND HELD
PREVIOUS ACTION
BILL: HCR 3
SHORT TITLE: SUPPORT ROADS/HOT SPRINGS LOOP ROAD
SPONSOR (S): REPRESENTATIVE (S) HOLM
Jrn-Date Jrn-Page Action
01/21/03 0024 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME -
REFERRALS
01/21/03 0024 (H) TRA
01/21/03 0024 (H) REFERRED TO TRANSPORTATION
01/30/03 (H) TRA AT 1:30 PM CAPITOL 17
01/30/03 (H) -- Meeting Postponed to
02/06/03--
02/06/03 (H) TRA AT 1:30 PM CAPITOL 17
WITNESS REGISTER
RALPH D. SWARTHOUT, Regional Director
Northern Region
Department of Transportation & Public Facilities (DOT&PF)
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in favor of HCR 3.
BOB MILLER, Owner
Circle Hot Springs
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in opposition to HCR 3.
DAVID LEONE
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Expressed concerns relating to HCR 3.
KARA MORIARTY, President and Chief Executive Officer
Greater Fairbanks Chamber of Commerce
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in favor of HCR 3.
LAURENCE BREDEMAN
Tanana Chiefs
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Expressed concerns relating to HCR 3.
ACTION NARRATIVE
TAPE 03-2, SIDE A
Number 0001
CO-CHAIR BEVERLY MASEK called the House Transportation Standing
Committee meeting to order at 1:34 p.m. Members present at the
call to order were Representatives Masek, Holm, Fate, Kohring,
Heinze, and Kookesh. Representative Kapsner arrived while the
meeting was in progress. Also present was Representative
Guttenberg.
HCR 3-SUPPORT ROADS/HOT SPRINGS LOOP ROAD
CO-CHAIR MASEK announced the order of business would be
CONCURRENT RESOLUTION NO. 3, "Relating to economic development
generated by new road construction and to the design and
construction of the Hot Springs Loop Road to connect Chena Hot
Springs and Circle Hot Springs."
Number 0111
CO-CHAIR HOLM, sponsor of HCR 3, noted that the committee packet
included a copy of the resolution with a fiscal note showing no
dollars, and a letter of support from the Greater Fairbanks
Chamber of Commerce. He said this particular road possibility
is related to economic development generated by new road
construction and to the design and construction of the Chena Hot
Springs Loop Road, which would connect Chena Hot Springs and
Circle Hot Springs. He said the idea was to open up areas that
are not frequently used, such as the Steese National
Conservation area, for tourism. Co-Chair Holm stated that the
purpose of the committee hearing would be fact-finding and to
see what people's ideas are regarding a possible road. Co-Chair
Holm alluded to the Xeroxed map before the committee and
explained that the orange highlighted line delineates the areas
that are state lands from the Steese National Conservation area.
He pointed out that the road would very possibly pass through
the conservation area. He added that the proposed road was
listed in the Fairbanks Chamber of Commerce's top 13 roads for
economic development for the Fairbanks area.
Number 0305
REPRESENTATIVE KOOKESH inquired as to the length of road, and
also the distance from Chena Hot Springs to the Steese Highway.
CO-CHAIR HOLM responded that a rough approximation of the road
would be between 100 and 120 miles, and that the distance from
Chena Hot Springs to the Steese Highway would probably not be
more than approximately 30 miles.
REPRESENTATIVE KOOKESH expressed concern about potential
difficulties involved with building a road through a
conservation area, noting that a lot of permitting may be
required.
Number 0484
REPRESENTATIVE FATE inquired as to the highest point of terrain
in the area and also asked if there would be any stream
crossings, which would entail bridges and would therefore
involve considerable expense.
CO-CHAIR HOLM responded that the intent is to see if there is
enough interest to pursue the project, and that at this point,
the route is not yet specified.
REPRESENTATIVE FATE noted that he is interested in any good
proposal for the state's transportation system, and said that it
is a matter of prioritizing, timelines, and having available
funds. He said the state needs a transportation system and he
is for a well thought-out transportation infrastructure.
Number 0567
REPRESENTATIVE HEINZE asked why Chena Hot Springs and Circle Hot
Springs were not being connected by the Steese Highway.
CO-CHAIR HOLM responded that the intention is not just to
connect the two points, but also to make a loop that would
provide a tourist destination. He also said there is difficulty
keeping the Steese Highway clean of snow in the winter, and this
would allow for more than one access.
CO-CHAIR MASEK, hearing no more questions for the sponsor from
committee members, asked for public testimony.
Number 0710
RALPH D. SWARTHOUT, Regional Director, Northern Region,
Department of Transportation & Public Facilities (DOT&PF),
testified in support of the project, for the department and for
himself, saying it represents a significant opportunity for
recreational and tourism enhancement and economic development;
he also said it falls in line with the governor's program of new
roads and economic development in the state. He stated that he
has proposed, to the commissioner, that a reconnaissance
project, which would take about one year to complete, be done
next year, to be included in the Statewide Transportation
Improvement Program (STIP). He explained that a reconnaissance
study allows for a look at solutions, benefits and costs of the
proposed project, and a preliminary look at social, economic,
and environmental issues associated with the project. He said
the results of a reconnaissance study would be either to
recommend proceeding with the project, going to an environmental
study, canceling, or deferring the project. He said the study
would provide answers to issues, and could be done in a year's
time for one-quarter million dollars. In response to an earlier
question from Representative Kookesh, he added that this project
would involve 55 or 60 miles of new road, and the loop itself
out of Fairbanks would be about 250 miles long.
MR. SWARTHOUT responded to a question from Representative
Heinze, confirming that the one-quarter million-dollar cost of
the study would be to take a preliminary look; however, he said
an Environmental Impact Statement (EIS) would be in excess of
one million dollars. He said the reconnaissance study would
provide ideas about what routes are available, what streams
would be crossed, what geotechnical issues would be involved,
and ways to deal with the Steese White Mountain area as well as
Birch Creek, which is a problematic area because it is a wild
and scenic river. He said it was important to bring these
issues together and make a recommendation in a believable
document showing the benefits and costs of the project, rather
than diving into a more costly EIS.
Number 0981
BOB MILLER, Owner, Circle Hot Springs, testified, stating that
he was 85 years old, had worked on roads since he was 15 or 16
years old, and was very familiar with roads. He said that
although he thinks this is a wonderful idea, in terms of
prioritizing he suggested that the 18-mile stretch of road
between Central and Circle City be repaired first, because it is
so dangerous. He said that even though this proposed road would
benefit his business, he recommends repairing the 18-mile
stretch first, because it would benefit the general public.
MR. MILLER continued by saying he does not understand who or
what is behind the resolution, and that he does not understand
why he was not contacted; he said the proposed road is on
wetlands, and is contrary to the environmentalists and the [U.S.
Army] Corps of Engineers.
Number 1238
DAVID LEONE testified, acknowledging that the area under
discussion was a beautiful section of the state with limited
access, and said his concern was that the road between these two
hot springs would in fact be used for mining first, and tourism
second. He said he did not have a problem with economic
development requiring the use and access of natural resources,
however he asked that expectations be clarified up-front; he
said that as a citizen he would appreciate such clarification.
He also expressed concern for ongoing year-round road
maintenance, particularly winterization, as a long-term
budgetary concern.
Number 1366
KARA MORIARTY, President and Chief Executive Officer, Greater
Fairbanks Chamber of Commerce, testified, and noted there was a
letter of support for this project. She said that in October
the chamber met with officials from the North Star Borough, the
City of Fairbanks, the City of North Pole, DOT&PF, and others.
The purpose of the meeting was to arrive at a general consensus
on projects and proposals to submit to Congressman Young, as
Chairman of the House Transportation Committee. She reported
this was one project they decided to lend support to, although
it is not in their top five priorities. She said they are
interested in looking at different areas and ideas to increase
commercial, mining, recreational, and winter-tourist activity.
She said the chamber is supportive of the concept, and of the
study regarding the road.
REPRESENTATIVE HEINZE asked if the Fairbanks Chamber of Commerce
had contacted either Mr. Miller of Circle Hot Springs or Bernie
Karl of Chena Hot Springs, and also asked if those gentlemen
were members of the chamber.
MS. MORIARITY responded that Chena Hot Springs is a member of
the chamber, although she had not spoken with Mr. Karl. She
said she does not believe Mr. Miller is a member of the chamber,
and that she has not had a personal conversation with either
men. Ms. Moriarty continued in response to a question from Co-
Chair Holm by saying that it was not protocol for the board to
contact all involved parties for a proposed project. She
mentioned that there were about 20 people at the committee
meeting, and 33 members on the chamber's board of directors,
including someone from the tourism industry, and that those 50
or so people were supportive of the concept. She said Mr. Karl
usually dials in from Chena Hot Springs, although the chamber
did not contact him directly.
Number 1591
CO-CHAIR HOLM said that Mr. Karl is aware of the project, and
has not necessarily talked in favor of it because he thinks
there are other priorities in the state; however, he is not
against it, either. Co-Chair Holm said that he and Senator
Wilken were looking at a loop road because it would afford
Fairbanks a beneficial destination for tourists. He noted that
his chief of staff had contacted Mr. Miller and invited him to
testify.
REPRESENTATIVE HEINZE suggested that perhaps some of the wording
be changed, from "connect Chena Hot Springs and Circle Hot
Springs", in order to clarify the concept of the road being part
of a loop out of Fairbanks.
Number 1683
REPRESENTATIVE KAPSNER asked how many businesses would be
positively affected in the Chena and Circle Hot Springs areas,
and also asked how lucrative the tourism industry boost would
be, if this project were to move forward.
MS. MORIARTY said that Mr. Karl operates the major business in
Chena Hot Springs, which has several hundred rooms, a convention
center, a swimming pool, et cetera. She said he offers a lot of
recreation and is not at capacity either in summer or in winter,
and is always looking for new opportunities.
MR. MILLER responded by saying there are at least 15 businesses
in the Circle Hot Springs area that would be affected along the
road.
REPRESENTATIVE KAPSNER asked how lucrative this would be in
terms of Japanese tourists, or other tourist markets.
MS. MORIARTY said there is an estimated three or four thousand
visitors to the Interior, many from Japan who come for aurora
borealis viewing; however, she said that someone from the
visitor industry would be better equipped to answer the
question.
MR. MILLER added that the focus of Circle Hot Springs has been
on Alaskans rather than on tourists. He said there are new
developments occurring, such as a bus service, which will be
available this year.
REPRESENTATIVE KOHRING stated that he supports road expansion,
and recommends that the sponsor consider giving more emphasis to
economic development, in addition to tourism, to include
developing resources such as timber, mining, shallow gas, or
coal. He said this would enhance the prospect of getting the
resolution through the legislative process, especially if it
costs millions of dollars to build the road.
Number 1973
LAURENCE BREDEMAN testified on behalf of the Tanana Chiefs,
representing Circle City. He said their priority is the stretch
of road between Central and Circle City. Mr. Bredeman agreed
with Mr. Miller's description of the road, confirming that it is
scenic and unsafe, and is in very poor shape. He said that
while the prospect of the proposed road is exciting, Tanana
Chiefs' priority is concern for the people who live in the
villages. Although tourism is important, he asked that the
legislature not forget that priorities should be with Alaskan
residents. He expressed concern that this be a situation in
which everybody wins, rather than a situation in which they are
losers in a win-lose situation.
CO-CHAIR MASEK noted that Co-Chair Holm had previously stated
that this was a fact-finding mission, and that the committee was
on the right track because at this point they were wanting to
get opinions and ideas, and were soliciting input from the
public.
REPRESENTATIVE FATE asked if there had been an assessment of the
need for an upgrade on the stretch of road between Circle City
and Central.
MR. SWARTHOUT responded by saying that a location study was
completed and the need to upgrade the road between Central and
Circle City had been recognized, as other needs in the region
have been recognized. He said he was fairly sure that a
complete location study, not a reconnaissance study, had been
done 15 years ago. He said he travels that section of roadway
several times a year, and the testimony is correct: it needs
some work.
Number 2172
REPRESENTATIVE FATE said he is perplexed that nothing has been
done in the past 15 years, if the description of road between
Circle City and Central is accurate.
MR. SWARTHOUT replied that needs in Alaska are great, and that
the road is not more life-threatening than others such as the
Taylor Highway from Chicken to Eagle, the McCarthy Highway from
Chitina to McCarthy, or the Denali Highway from mile 21 to
Cantwell. He confirmed that it is a narrow, dirt, winding road
with site-distance problems, and that it is important to pay
close attention while driving; however, he said this was not "an
accident waiting to happen." He said he supports more money
flowing north, since there is a large need that is not being met
on a continual basis.
REPRESENTATIVE KOHRING said that if this project were to advance
to the STIP process and compete for funding, then involving
other industries that also wanted access into this area, such as
the mining industry, would expedite the process.
CO-CHAIR HOLM said he did not know what the restrictions would
be, as the majority of the road would be in a conservation area.
He said perhaps Representative Fate would have an understanding
of this process.
REPRESENTATIVE FATE said that at the time this was made into a
conservation unit, he was a miner, and most of the people with
placer claims were forced to move out, so there is literally no
mining industry in the area at the present time. He said it
would be very difficult to develop this area for mining.
Number 2215
CO-CHAIR MASEK asked for further elaboration on types of mining.
REPRESENTATIVE FATE differentiated placer mining from hard-rock
mining. He explained that placer mining involves mining
alluvial deposits such as gravel, whereas hard-rock mining
requires crushing rock until it is talcum-powder fine, and then
separating the mineral or metal from the rest of that rock
before further refining it. He explained that the initial
mining is either on the surface, where dynamite is used to blast
out huge tonnages of rock, or it is done by tunnel, as in
horizontal and vertical shafts, that go into the heart of the
mountain. He said that placer mining takes place in streambeds,
and is done by a dragline or a dredge that refines the alluvial
deposits through a series of sluice boxes. In response to a
question from Co-Chair Masek, Representative Fate said the
conservation area was opened up in the mid to late '80s.
TAPE 03-2, SIDE B
Number 2382
MR. MILLER reiterated that he has been driving just about every
other day for 72 years, knows the roads very well, and thinks
the 18-mile stretch from Circle City to Central is perhaps the
most dangerous road in Alaska that he has seen. He said the
first part of the road from Central into Circle City is all
right, but coming from the other direction, from Circle City, is
absolutely dangerous.
CO-CHAIR MASEK said she raced the Iditarod for four years, and
when the mining was booming, roads were built where she mushed
her team into Ruby. She said the infrastructure exists, but the
question of what to do with it remains.
MR. MILLER commented on how important roads are, how they open
up "a heck of a country" and that a road from Fairbanks to
Bethel, or a road to Nome is extremely important.
CO-CHAIR MASEK said HCR 3 would be held in committee.
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
Transportation Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at 2:25
p.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|